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Anomaly
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PostSubject: Movment Costs...   Movment Costs... Icon_minitimeMon Apr 19, 2010 10:00 am

How much of a watch's cost is due to the movement?

From a $50 Fossil to say a $9000 Seadweller?

From a company that just puts the movement in the watch as they get it from the manufacturer to the company that customizes a standard movement from say ETA or the like?

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PostSubject: Re: Movment Costs...   Movment Costs... Icon_minitimeMon Apr 19, 2010 11:13 am

Wow...what a loaded question. Glad it's here, and not elsewhere — where the Kool-Aid makes folks think that a G10 is a perfectly acceptable "engine" in a $500 watch...and are fond of using Rolex as an example.

Maybe that's why I don't own a Rolex.

I'd like to think that of the watches I own — at least, those I plan to keep — that the movement represents half the cost of the watch. At that, however, I'm doubtless being naive, since I'll keep a few Renatos (and realize that the 251.272 quartz movement isn't worth $200...but at least it isn't a throwaway movement.) That said, the Renatos are more eye-candy than anything else...and there's a place for eye candy...
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merichar
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PostSubject: Re: Movment Costs...   Movment Costs... Icon_minitimeMon Apr 19, 2010 3:18 pm

There are too many variables for a specific answer. We'll never really know what the companies paid for the movements. Time lapse between movement order and use and the negotiated price they paid are also unknowns. Add to that the sometimes wildly fluctuating prices for the same watch from different sources. All I know is that I can look up what I can get a movement for from Esslinger or another dealer. I have seen watches sell new for little more than the retail cost of the movement and I have seen watches sell for as much as 30-40 times the retail cost of the movement.
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PostSubject: Re: Movment Costs...   Movment Costs... Icon_minitimeMon Apr 19, 2010 4:44 pm

This is a question I have really never been able to get an answer to ! Movment Costs... Icon_eek
Have thought about, looked up movement prices, watch prices, and
what different things cost, but never really found a definitive answer.
I think that a watches cost due to the movement actually changes
depending on the brand we are buying from. For a less expensive
watch, the movement may actually be a big chunk of the cost.
Maybe 50% or so ! (Just guessing)..However, with more expensive
watches like that Seadweller, the movement may not be that big of
a percentage. It's possible that the percentage could be way less.
Much of the price on a higher end watch may have to do more with
the "name", rather than the movement itself. Not that the watch
isn't great, but the movement cost is probably less of a percentage
than it would be on a less expensive watch. So I guess it depends
on the watch, when trying to figure this one out ! Movment Costs... Icon_smile

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Anomaly
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PostSubject: Re: Movment Costs...   Movment Costs... Icon_minitimeMon Apr 19, 2010 5:03 pm

IMO, unless they are in-house movements or REALLY modified ETAs, the actual movement cost is probably at BEST 20% of the cost of the entire watch...

...and I don't have a problem with that. The BIGGEST gauge of price for a watch is...

...your PERSONAL tastes.

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PostSubject: Re: Movment Costs...   Movment Costs... Icon_minitimeMon Apr 19, 2010 5:57 pm

Anomaly wrote:
IMO, unless they are in-house movements or REALLY modified ETAs, the actual movement cost is probably at BEST 20% of the cost of the entire watch...

...and I don't have a problem with that. The BIGGEST gauge of price for a watch is...

...your PERSONAL tastes.

Jeez, you really know how to burst a guy's bubble...

However, this brings up yet another salient question to ponder: when you do find a "good deal," it is usually for a watch that's last year's models, if not a bit long in the tooth.

Examples: I recently bought an SWI LE -

http://www.worldofwatches.com/detail.asp?bo_products_variance_id=76058

and a Maurice Lacroix Pontos Rectangulaire Reserve de Marche —

http://www.worldofwatches.com/detail.asp?bo_products_variance_id=75775

Got each of them for right around $500. Both usually are on sale for around $1,200 (ok, ok, or less). At $1,200, I can see the movements being 20% of the value of the watch; at $500, a much higher percentage........

HOWEVER, do you take into account that, being older models, you may be faced with a "major tune-up" much earlier, and so factor that cost into the price you are willing to spend...or not?
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PostSubject: Re: Movment Costs...   Movment Costs... Icon_minitimeMon Apr 19, 2010 6:24 pm

With the lubricants used it watches today, service is never really a consideration in my watch buying...

I do prefer buying one still under warranty if not new...

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PostSubject: depends on the Movement   Movment Costs... Icon_minitimeWed Apr 21, 2010 11:14 am

Depends what your buying. I saw a Ducati branded watch , with a 7750, selling for 5 or 600 USD, forget the exact amount.
So depending on how many they bought, its somewhere between 50, to 75% of the watch!

25% would be a good indicator, for a Swiss watch with a 2892, 35% with the COSC movement or so.

Hard to pin down, but most companies cant buy direct from ETA, so they use a broker, and the costs are of course more.

You cant buy a Rolex movement, because they are not silly. If you knew it cost them 100 Euros to make it, and 100 to make the case, then you wouldn't shell out 6 grand to get one.

I dont know what it costs Rolex, i have no inside info, but the Sea Dweller movement is compared as equal or close to, the ETA 2892, and while different, its not magic.
So if an ETA 2892 COSC movement can be had for 250 Euros or so, then whats it really cost for Rolex to produce one. They have the equipment after all.

The cost of the watch itself, you could write a book on, as there is much more to it than just the sum of its parts. All the overheads that starting, owning, and running a business entails.

But to me, if your paying 5k for a watch with an ETA 2824 in it, and its not solid gold, then all i can say, is they saw you coming.
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PostSubject: Re: Movment Costs...   Movment Costs... Icon_minitimeWed Apr 21, 2010 11:21 am

t20569cald wrote:
Depends what your buying. I saw a Ducati branded watch , with a 7750, selling for 5 or 600 USD, forget the exact amount.
So depending on how many they bought, its somewhere between 50, to 75% of the watch!

25% would be a good indicator, for a Swiss watch with a 2892, 35% with the COSC movement or so.

Hard to pin down, but most companies cant buy direct from ETA, so they use a broker, and the costs are of course more.

You cant buy a Rolex movement, because they are not silly. If you knew it cost them 100 Euros to make it, and 100 to make the case, then you wouldn't shell out 6 grand to get one.

I dont know what it costs Rolex, i have no inside info, but the Sea Dweller movement is compared as equal or close to, the ETA 2892, and while different, its not magic.
So if an ETA 2892 COSC movement can be had for 250 Euros or so, then whats it really cost for Rolex to produce one. They have the equipment after all.

The cost of the watch itself, you could write a book on, as there is much more to it than just the sum of its parts. All the overheads that starting, owning, and running a business entails.

But to me, if your paying 5k for a watch with an ETA 2824 in it, and its not solid gold, then all i can say, is they saw you coming.

And there in lies the eclecticness of watch collecting...

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PostSubject: Re: Movment Costs...   Movment Costs... Icon_minitimeWed Apr 21, 2010 12:56 pm

its not a big secret about the component costs minus the movement.A chinese watch factory owner posted an article last year on per unit costs of the case components.Now this is just for most of the chinese watch cases.He said the case,thats the mid case,crown stem,bezel,crystal,caseback on a large production run was about 7.00 usd per case. straps were under 1.00 usd and bracelets 4.00 usd.For most of the chinese watches,the movement is the lions share of the price.Thats why we see such a huge disparity in pricing between brands and models.This is only for the mass produced watches made in chinese factories.
his point was they make a profit on selling a rolex submariner replica for 25.00 usd.The movement used is the ty2806.Thats the lions share of the watches cost.its actually a pretty good movement. invictas,renatos that are chinese produced? they sell the 2896 for 89.00. per unit cost with a 150% mark up.That watch
didn't cost crap to make.
About that eta g10 that someone in this thread brought up.Thats a sore spot with me.why is it used and preferred by companies that make watches from 50 bucks up to a few grand? its a 4 jewel nylon movement.its non repairable.big frigging deal.its accurate,more reliable and add a nylon case holder and the true nature of that movement is shown.its for durability,longevity,accuracy and the point that gets missed by the movement snobs is its shock resistance.
the 251.272 isn't any more accurate.it breaks.its expensive to repair.it doesn't have a quickset date and that kills it for me with that movement.
so the hour hand can be set indepentantly.at the cost of a quickset date.wow.check the marathon tsar.a one jewel high torque isa.its used,again,for its shock resistance and durability and its wider temperature range. when you post bad movement info,its because you heard it from some other person who didn't have a clue either.thats my rant for today. the very large companies like invicta doesn't pay squat for per unit cost minus the movement.20%? not for any quartz watch invicta produces,or even the automatics.The movement is the highest cost part for they're watches.
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PostSubject: Re: Movment Costs...   Movment Costs... Icon_minitimeWed Apr 21, 2010 1:06 pm

yamahaki wrote:

About that eta g10 that someone in this thread brought up.Thats a sore spot with me.why is it used and preferred by companies that make watches from 50 bucks up to a few grand? its a 4 jewel nylon movement.its non repairable.big frigging deal.its accurate,more reliable and add a nylon case holder and the true nature of that movement is shown.its for durability,longevity,accuracy and the point that gets missed by the movement snobs is its shock resistance.
the 251.272 isn't any more accurate.it breaks.its expensive to repair.it doesn't have a quickset date and that kills it for me with that movement.
so the hour hand can be set indepentantly.at the cost of a quickset date.wow.check the marathon tsar.a one jewel high torque isa.its used,again,for its shock resistance and durability and its wider temperature range. when you post bad movement info,its because you heard it from some other person who didn't have a clue either.thats my rant for today. the very large companies like invicta doesn't pay squat for per unit cost minus the movement.20%? not for any quartz watch invicta produces,or even the automatics.The movement is the highest cost part for they're watches.

Sean:

I mentioned the G10.....and I didn't question its accuracy; my statement only focused on its cost in relation to the cost of the watch. If someone wants to pay a few grand for a watch that contains a movement that costs $30 (or so, whatever), more power to them.
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