Zodiac does Homage?

Saw this for sale on WUS...



Strikingly familiar...

Looks like it...

first there is " Homage " which dont get me started
Then " Copy "
Then " Fake"
Now " Rip Off " ?????

t20569cald wrote:

first there is " Homage " which dont get me started
Then " Copy "
Then " Fake"
Now " Rip Off " ?????

Yeah I hear you...

...the Zodiac is a BLATANT copy. Never known Zodiac to do that....

Hmmm....

How old is the original? Sorry but redoing watches that have not been in production for decades isn't a ripoff IMHO.

Go through the zodiac catalog before they were bought out.You'll be surprised at the amount and variety of models that zodiac did.
most watches today have similarities to vintage pieces.The one pictured is a 24 hour dial.How many companies split the dial?probably
alot.this isn't a copy,homage,fake or rip off.if that was the case then half the watches we own would be rip offs.

yamahaki wrote:

Go through the zodiac catalog before they were bought out.You'll be surprised at the amount and variety of models that zodiac did.
most watches today have similarities to vintage pieces.The one pictured is a 24 hour dial.How many companies split the dial?probably
alot.this isn't a copy,homage,fake or rip off.if that was the case then half the watches we own would be rip offs.

Funny that Sean, because just the other day i was thinking half the watches i own, are rip offs!

I am the first to admit, that its hard to make a new ground breaking design these days, and there is nothing wrong with taking some cues from other brands, and even more so if they are decades old.
But in my book, there is taking something or maybe two things from a watch, and maybe even borrowing something from another watch, and doing something unique-ish, but not earth shattering.
Then there is taking 4, 5, or 6 points from one watch, doing 2 of your own, and slapping your name on it.
Its a touch rip off for me Sean, but in their defense, its an old watch, and they have added ( Just ) enough of their own to be maybe in the "Homage " arena.
It does not make me feel outraged like some, ( it does not take much ) so i can live with Zodiac doing it.
But i still wouldnt feel good wearing it about, knowing that they were a bit lazy on this one.

Anomaly wrote:

t20569cald wrote:

first there is " Homage " which dont get me started
Then " Copy "
Then " Fake"
Now " Rip Off " ?????

Yeah I hear you...

...the Zodiac is a BLATANT copy. Never known Zodiac to do that....

And well spotted by the way

A touch of research indicates that the company went out of business in the 1970's. Sheffield Watch Co. was from England but late in its life bought watches from Swiss makers (hmmmm) to sell with its name on their dial.

Perhaps its not a homage but a revived version of their own watch that was sold under the Sheffield name in the 60-70s period?

Docrwm wrote:

A touch of research indicates that the company went out of business in the 1970's. Sheffield Watch Co. was from England but late in its life bought watches from Swiss makers (hmmmm) to sell with its name on their dial.

Perhaps its not a homage but a revived version of their own watch that was sold under the Sheffield name in the 60-70s period?

Oh...I like that better!

Docrwm wrote:

A touch of research indicates that the company went out of business in the 1970's. Sheffield Watch Co. was from England but late in its life bought watches from Swiss makers (hmmmm) to sell with its name on their dial.

Perhaps its not a homage but a revived version of their own watch that was sold under the Sheffield name in the 60-70s period?

Thats what I was thinking.look at how many different zodiac seawolfs were done,then look at all the other brands during that era
and they all took ques from the zodiac dive line.

of course the boldest take on another watch is the zeno sel 300. the bezel is identical to doxa. But the rest of the watch is
total zeno from the movement to the plastic domed crystal.

"That's my story, and I'm sticking to it."

This is interesting ! I can't deny there is a real similarity with
these two watches. I hope Doc is right about it actually being
a Zodiac with the Sheffield name being used. I guess the
length of time between watches makes me feel a little better
also. It's actually really fun looking at vintage watches, and seeing
the similarities that different brands had with eachother. Sometimes
you might see VERY similar cases, or styles from Omega, Tissot,
Zodiac etc., and I just connect it to the time that these watches
happened to be out. Maybe this Zodiac could have looked to the
past to make this one, not really sure ! VERY interesting though !
Thanks !

porschefan wrote:

"That's my story, and I'm sticking to it."

Well, the dial does say BOTH Sheffield and Swiss Made - problem is there was no Swiss Sheffield Factory......oh, wait - that hasn't ever stopped THEM.....never mind.

Docrwm wrote:

porschefan wrote:

"That's my story, and I'm sticking to it."

Well, the dial does say BOTH Sheffield and Swiss Made - problem is there was no Swiss Sheffield Factory......oh, wait - that hasn't ever stopped THEM.....never mind.

yamahaki wrote:

Go through the zodiac catalog before they were bought out.You'll be surprised at the amount and variety of models that zodiac did.
most watches today have similarities to vintage pieces.The one pictured is a 24 hour dial.How many companies split the dial?probably
alot.this isn't a copy,homage,fake or rip off.if that was the case then half the watches we own would be rip offs.

Couldn't agree more on that, today most of the watches are in fact a remake of some other watches design. I think that it wouldn't be a problem until the makes copy all of the features of the watch including even the pattern and the colour. Now, at lest in this case, Zodiac, just had the concept but the had the designing in a slightly different manner. I don't see anything wrong in that as it is said that the new watches are derived from the earlier ones.

I should go buy it!! I had the Zodiac and sold it. I figured it was an original Zodiac design that Sheffield bought and used in England.

Anomaly wrote:

Saw this for sale on WUS...



Strikingly familiar...

Start looking at both closely.The only thing similar is the 2 color split on the dial.The Sheffield doesn't have a date, its case is more of a compressor style with
hooded lugs.The crown is resessed.Stick hands.It also has a 24 hour dial and bezel.
The Zodiacs case is different,has an exterior non hooded crown, uses a 12 hour dial and a 24 hour bezel.plus the hands are pure Zodiac.
Those hands have been used by zodiac though all of the seawolf iterations through the years and on the silver, red and blue dot models.
And after digging around on some of the vintage sites,Sheffiield looks more like a private label brand that was done by Zodiac.

t20569cald wrote:

first there is " Homage " which dont get me started
Then " Copy "
Then " Fake"
Now " Rip Off " ?????

Get a grip.You've been on a number of forums, the latest at wus yelling ripoff in one of their active homage threads and always
use the fact that you are designing a watch.Big frigging deal.You'll have better luck selling your watch to wis by toning down
these commentaries about homage watches.While you think these are copies and replicas,90% of forum members don't.
You bring up that you are designing a watch and although its an original concept from your mind, most of the the design cues
are from other brands.Well by your own definition,your own watch will be a ripoff of not just one, but multiple brands.

You say they are cutting corners and doing cookie cutter watches.What process are they cutting out?please explain that part to me.
I do cad and design work for a number of motorcycle companies.While its quicker when modifying a part when they send
the cad drawing,99% of the time,even though its going to be a similar part that is upgraded,I still have to design it and
take they're concept and make it work.
Companies that make homage watches or fake watches by your definition still can't cut corners.
They have to go from a rendering on paper to cad,prototype it,then do the tooling, then make sure that every part fits and works,
source parts,then spend months testing to meet din and iso standards.After all of that it can move into production.
So I don't see any shortcutting here.You bringing a watch to market is no different than every other watch company
that has to have other companies make they're product.Don't make it sound like yours is special in some way.Its not.

The only way the process can be speeded up is if you went to fricker or ickler and used an existing case as the basis for your watch
like kremke did with the subzilla.If you look at something like these two watches that are shown in this post and make your
opinion soley on the superficial appearance,you do both companies a disservice.

Also,something you are finding out by trying to use swiss and german companies to get your watch done is that while you
can get a swiss company or German company to make your dials,you still don't know if those companies
source there own materials and parts from asia.Welcome to reality.

yamahaki wrote:

t20569cald wrote:

first there is " Homage " which dont get me started
Then " Copy "
Then " Fake"
Now " Rip Off " ?????

Get a grip.You've been on a number of forums, the latest at wus yelling ripoff in one of their active homage threads and always
use the fact that you are designing a watch.Big frigging deal.You'll have better luck selling your watch to wis by toning down
these commentaries about homage watches.While you think these are copies and replicas,90% of forum members don't.
You bring up that you are designing a watch and although its an original concept from your mind, most of the the design cues
are from other brands.Well by your own definition,your own watch will be a ripoff of not just one, but multiple brands.

You say they are cutting corners and doing cookie cutter watches.What process are they cutting out?please explain that part to me.
I do cad and design work for a number of motorcycle companies.While its quicker when modifying a part when they send
the cad drawing,99% of the time,even though its going to be a similar part that is upgraded,I still have to design it and
take they're concept and make it work.
Companies that make homage watches or fake watches by your definition still can't cut corners.
They have to go from a rendering on paper to cad,prototype it,then do the tooling, then make sure that every part fits and works,
source parts,then spend months testing to meet din and iso standards.After all of that it can move into production.
So I don't see any shortcutting here.You bringing a watch to market is no different than every other watch company
that has to have other companies make they're product.Don't make it sound like yours is special in some way.Its not.

The only way the process can be speeded up is if you went to fricker or ickler and used an existing case as the basis for your watch
like kremke did with the subzilla.If you look at something like these two watches that are shown in this post and make your
opinion soley on the superficial appearance,you do both companies a disservice.

Also,something you are finding out by trying to use swiss and german companies to get your watch done is that while you
can get a swiss company or German company to make your dials,you still don't know if those companies
source there own materials and parts from asia.Welcome to reality.

Sean, first off, i am not here to sell you a watch.
Sure, the forums are a great tool, and a good way to market it, but i am here firstly because i want to be, and i will say whatever i feel. I am toning down nothing!
If my opinions are too much for some, and they dont want to buy a watch from me, then fine, i can live happily with that, but your the only person so far to make a post personal.
I dont recall saying they cut corners!
I dont recall saying anything you mention in fact.
You seem to have gone off on one, about cutting corners. Cut and paste my post here, and i will explain it to you, but since i dont recall using that term, i cant do it without it.

Anyway Sean
If we all shared the same opinions, it would make for very boring forums dont you think?

This is one of those "beauty is in the eye of the beholder (or beer holder) issues...

Everyone has an opinion...

NO ONE is wrong!

Thanks for the participation on this topic!